Talk:Did Einstein and other famous scientists believe in god?

anon guy wrote:

"Just so you understand, Christians do infact understand Einstein was not a Christian. BUT you need to understand that Einstein believed that God was responsible. So when you continue on in your paper, I hope that you will include all facts, not just trying to make Christians look like dults."

What's a dult?

Your claim is weak. Einstein made it very clear he was not a theist. He used the term "God" metaphorically, in an abstract sense. This has absolutely nothing to do with your definition of God.--Pile 11:07, 15 January 2008 (CST)

You know, a pantheist is a kind of theist. It seems to me that this article is assuming that because Einstein doesn't believe in a personal God, that he is some sort of atheist or agnostic. The ancients didn't believe in a personal God either, but I wouldn't describe them as atheists by any means. It seems to me that there is good reason to suppose that Einstein may have believed in a First Principle of some kind.

Pantheism, especially the way Einstein mentioned it (which he appears to have abandoned for strict weak atheism later in life according to letters), is more or less a symbolic, metaphorical identifier. I could say I'm a pantheist as well, recognizing that I am dependent upon "mother earth" for my existence. Unless there's evidence that Einstein actually worshipped some one or some thing, I'd draw a big distinction between theism and pantheism as it relates to Einstein's beliefs or lack thereof.--Pile 10:22, 10 April 2009 (CDT)

I'd like to offer a suggestion relating to the term "Pantheism" as used in the context of Spinoza and Einstein. Baruch Spinoza was a Portuguese Jew whose family migrated to Amsterdam to escape the Portuguese Inquisition, whereas and Albert Einstein was an Ashkenazi Jewish family in Germany. Firstly, from the perspective of their religious backgrounds, Baruch Spinoza came from a locale where he faced being burnt alive if he "Judaized"...hence Spinoza's monotheism, and rejection of christian notions of a church-defined Godhead, was the very purpose of his existence. Persecution and the fear of persecution was the forge of his very identity. Einstein did not grow up in an environment such as Spinoza. In fact, we could argue that Einstein didn't face anything remotely resembling overt anti-semitism until the 1920's when the "Anti-Relativity Society" decried Einstein's "Jewish Science".

Make no mistake, both Baruch Spinoza and Albert Einstein vacillated when it came to adhering to any profession of religious faith which harmonized with Maimonides' Thirteen Principles of Faith. Nonetheless, that renders them simply as Jews who saw the world different than other Jews of their respective communities. That Baruch Spinoza refused to accept the decrees of community leaders resulted in him being excommunicated to trying to lure followers from the local Jewish Community to a syncretic form of monism. Indeed, he was excommunicated...but he did not adopt the position of "the enemies of my enemies are my friends". Einstein, in contradistinction to Spinoza, never adopted a world-view that incubated the monistic notion of worshiping the creation instead of the creator (Pantheism). Instead, and this is the point of my post herein, Einstein adopted a Panentheistic view of the world...worshipping "Mother Earth" was not his forte... Panentheism [1] is a very different 'ism' than pantheism.

One year prior to his death, Einstein participated in an interview with William Hermanns. Hermanns asked Einstein to state precisely his views concerning God - here is what Einstein told Hermanns in a book titled "Einstein and the Poet: In Search of the Cosmic Poet" on page 148:

"About God, I cannot accept any concept based on the authority of the Church. As long as I can remember, I have resented mass indoctrination. I do not believe in the fear of life, in the fear of death, in blind faith. I cannot prove to you that there is no personal God, but if I were to speak of him, I would be a liar. I do not believe in the God of Theology who rewards good and punishes evil. My God created laws that take care of that. His Universe is not ruled by wishful thinking, but by immutable laws".

You must remember that the definition of God, according to community customs in which Einstein was raised, was not the definition of God according to local Christians. There is not one single interview of Einstein where he implies or infers a belief in a godhead other than that of his Jewish roots...but there are numerous interviews where Einstein espoises a clear separation between God and the Universe (God doesn't play dice with the Universe). In a Pantheistic framework that phrase would read (God doesn't play with himself).

So in conclusion, I would like to underscore the need to re-write this article to reflect and Panenteistic world-view rather than a Pantheistic world view; it is a truthful statement of evidentiary fact. Jimharlow99 15:25, 29 October 2013 (CDT)